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	<title>Comments on: Employers can provide affordable housing</title>
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	<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/</link>
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		<title>By: biliruben</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326813</link>
		<dc:creator>biliruben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 04:07:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326813</guid>
		<description>Well what you were describing didn&#039;t sound like Stanford, Ardell.

I just wanted to know whether anyone had any knowledge about Stanford; it&#039;s successes and failures and how it worked in practice.  I&#039;ve heard the waiting list is now so long that their system is essentially broken, but that&#039;s just what I&#039;ve heard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well what you were describing didn&#8217;t sound like Stanford, Ardell.</p>
<p>I just wanted to know whether anyone had any knowledge about Stanford; it&#8217;s successes and failures and how it worked in practice.  I&#8217;ve heard the waiting list is now so long that their system is essentially broken, but that&#8217;s just what I&#8217;ve heard.</p>
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		<title>By: Robbie</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326800</link>
		<dc:creator>Robbie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 02:38:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326800</guid>
		<description>Cool idea - although I would think large tech companies in Silicon Valley would be all over this idea before Microsoft jumped on it.

As long as the prices of Silicon Valley homes for Apple, Yahoo, Google, eBay, etc employees cost a lot more than they do in Seattle/Redmond for Microsoft, Amazon, etc employees, I don&#039;t think MS would have a strong incentive to implement something like this. Although, I think it would be great idea, especially since the era of golden handcuffs has turned to bronze.

According to Zillow, an average home in Mountain View, CA costs $300K more than one in Redmond, WA does and according to Glass Door (Barton&#039;s other startup), your average Software Engineer at MS only makes about $5K less/year than their Valley compatriots.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cool idea &#8211; although I would think large tech companies in Silicon Valley would be all over this idea before Microsoft jumped on it.</p>
<p>As long as the prices of Silicon Valley homes for Apple, Yahoo, Google, eBay, etc employees cost a lot more than they do in Seattle/Redmond for Microsoft, Amazon, etc employees, I don&#8217;t think MS would have a strong incentive to implement something like this. Although, I think it would be great idea, especially since the era of golden handcuffs has turned to bronze.</p>
<p>According to Zillow, an average home in Mountain View, CA costs $300K more than one in Redmond, WA does and according to Glass Door (Barton&#8217;s other startup), your average Software Engineer at MS only makes about $5K less/year than their Valley compatriots.</p>
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		<title>By: ARDELL</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326788</link>
		<dc:creator>ARDELL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 00:34:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326788</guid>
		<description>Employers spend scads of money helping new hires buy houses and transferred employees sell houses.  Always have and always will.

Companies give a ton of money away to &quot;worthy causes&quot;.

What Employers don&#039;t do enough of is help the existing employees with housing issues, which is a VERY worthy cause.

Kind of like the man that sends flowers to his girlfriend at work every Monday, to brighten her work week...until he marries her.  Then its, &quot;What&#039;s for dinner!?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Employers spend scads of money helping new hires buy houses and transferred employees sell houses.  Always have and always will.</p>
<p>Companies give a ton of money away to &#8220;worthy causes&#8221;.</p>
<p>What Employers don&#8217;t do enough of is help the existing employees with housing issues, which is a VERY worthy cause.</p>
<p>Kind of like the man that sends flowers to his girlfriend at work every Monday, to brighten her work week&#8230;until he marries her.  Then its, &#8220;What&#8217;s for dinner!?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: ARDELL</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326786</link>
		<dc:creator>ARDELL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 00:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326786</guid>
		<description>biliruben,

For the record, &quot;The University&quot; in this post is not Stanford.  Biliruben, whether it be a builder or a complex or a University, once the entity is stated, the discussion can&#039;t continue.  Lawsuits are filed when you start naming names and transparency is crushed in the process.

I once wrote a post about general builder practices, which is quite useful to the buying public.  Then in the comments someone said &quot;X builder does that!&quot;  Once you name an institution or a company...it hinders the process of free flow of information.

I say this for the benefit of all readers and people who comment.  It&#039;s why I sue generics like &quot;Powers That Be&quot; and &quot;University&quot;.

The World craves transparency, but there are things that will prevent it from growing:

1) Naming Names
2) McCain using the word in Presidential Debates :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>biliruben,</p>
<p>For the record, &#8220;The University&#8221; in this post is not Stanford.  Biliruben, whether it be a builder or a complex or a University, once the entity is stated, the discussion can&#8217;t continue.  Lawsuits are filed when you start naming names and transparency is crushed in the process.</p>
<p>I once wrote a post about general builder practices, which is quite useful to the buying public.  Then in the comments someone said &#8220;X builder does that!&#8221;  Once you name an institution or a company&#8230;it hinders the process of free flow of information.</p>
<p>I say this for the benefit of all readers and people who comment.  It&#8217;s why I sue generics like &#8220;Powers That Be&#8221; and &#8220;University&#8221;.</p>
<p>The World craves transparency, but there are things that will prevent it from growing:</p>
<p>1) Naming Names<br />
2) McCain using the word in Presidential Debates <img src='http://raincityguide.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: biliruben</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326784</link>
		<dc:creator>biliruben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 23:56:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326784</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve heard Stanford subsidizes their profs.  I would love to hear the details of how that works, if anyone knows.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve heard Stanford subsidizes their profs.  I would love to hear the details of how that works, if anyone knows.</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy K</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326783</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 23:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326783</guid>
		<description>I like Russ&#039; idea of down payment assistance.   That would be very easy to implement.  Another option would be for employers to recognize that it costs more to live in one place vs. another and to handle employees&#039; housing needs accordingly.  The military and government recognize this and provide larger housing stipends when you are stationed someplace that is more expensive.  Civilian employers don&#039;t always seem to recognize this.  One of the things that has always struck me as odd is that if you are, for instance, an aerospace engineer working at a certain level, your pay scale is roughly the same regardless of whether you are working in Seattle, St. Louis, or Birmingham Alabama.  Yet, cost of living is quite different.  $70k a year is a different animal here vs. in St. Louis.  It&#039;s actually gotten to the point that I think this is a threat to our local economy - I&#039;ve had clients come here for what they thought were good paying jobs, and then find out what it was going to cost them to live, and decide that they weren&#039;t going to move here after all.  Doesn&#039;t happen often but if the lifestyle they can afford someplace else is enough better, it can make it tough to convince them to relocate here.  It also reduces competitiveness of local businesses.  This is not unrelated, for instance, to some of the factors underlying the IAM strike at Boeing...and rumor has it SPEEA is also talking strike.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like Russ&#8217; idea of down payment assistance.   That would be very easy to implement.  Another option would be for employers to recognize that it costs more to live in one place vs. another and to handle employees&#8217; housing needs accordingly.  The military and government recognize this and provide larger housing stipends when you are stationed someplace that is more expensive.  Civilian employers don&#8217;t always seem to recognize this.  One of the things that has always struck me as odd is that if you are, for instance, an aerospace engineer working at a certain level, your pay scale is roughly the same regardless of whether you are working in Seattle, St. Louis, or Birmingham Alabama.  Yet, cost of living is quite different.  $70k a year is a different animal here vs. in St. Louis.  It&#8217;s actually gotten to the point that I think this is a threat to our local economy &#8211; I&#8217;ve had clients come here for what they thought were good paying jobs, and then find out what it was going to cost them to live, and decide that they weren&#8217;t going to move here after all.  Doesn&#8217;t happen often but if the lifestyle they can afford someplace else is enough better, it can make it tough to convince them to relocate here.  It also reduces competitiveness of local businesses.  This is not unrelated, for instance, to some of the factors underlying the IAM strike at Boeing&#8230;and rumor has it SPEEA is also talking strike.</p>
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		<title>By: Russ</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326777</link>
		<dc:creator>Russ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 19:01:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326777</guid>
		<description>One way employers could help is through down payments.  Usually the biggest obstacle in buying a home is the down payment.   Also, the gift of the down payment from the employer also acts as a retention tool in that you would need to pay it back if they left the company voluntarily.  This would ultimately lower recruiting cost of employees since the turnover would be lower.

In fact, it doesn&#039;t even have to be a gift.  It could be a second mortgage.  We have a University here in Chicago that offers 2nd mortgages to their employees which is a big deal now because banks have all but abandoned the second mortgage market.

Ironically, owning a home is usually people&#039;s largest financial expense yet most employers do nothing to help lessen that burden which could be a huge benefit to employees and definitely increase employee/company loyalty.  

Another idea is subsidizing the cost of ownership.  In some way acting as a non-occupant co-borrower so the mortgage is affordable by most standards in high cost of living areas.

Heck, some companies might even consider just giving certain employees a low interest loan and just cutting out banks altogether.  

I am sure there are plenty of innovative ways to encourage homeownership and lessen the burdern on their employees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One way employers could help is through down payments.  Usually the biggest obstacle in buying a home is the down payment.   Also, the gift of the down payment from the employer also acts as a retention tool in that you would need to pay it back if they left the company voluntarily.  This would ultimately lower recruiting cost of employees since the turnover would be lower.</p>
<p>In fact, it doesn&#8217;t even have to be a gift.  It could be a second mortgage.  We have a University here in Chicago that offers 2nd mortgages to their employees which is a big deal now because banks have all but abandoned the second mortgage market.</p>
<p>Ironically, owning a home is usually people&#8217;s largest financial expense yet most employers do nothing to help lessen that burden which could be a huge benefit to employees and definitely increase employee/company loyalty.  </p>
<p>Another idea is subsidizing the cost of ownership.  In some way acting as a non-occupant co-borrower so the mortgage is affordable by most standards in high cost of living areas.</p>
<p>Heck, some companies might even consider just giving certain employees a low interest loan and just cutting out banks altogether.  </p>
<p>I am sure there are plenty of innovative ways to encourage homeownership and lessen the burdern on their employees.</p>
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		<title>By: will</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326775</link>
		<dc:creator>will</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 18:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326775</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s quite common in Japan for employees to take housing from their employers.  This home is not owned but is rented from the employer at a seriously subsidized amount (average about 33% of market value).  Where I was renting privately a small studio for about $800/month one of my Japanese friends not too far away (two stations) had a two bedroom place for $400/month.  There are also often dormitories for employees to rent (like college dorms) with shared facilities which are ridiculously cheap (think about $100 or even free).  While handy they sure do not lend well to a social life separate from the firm.  And this is not a new idea.  It&#039;s been done since forever.

I think it&#039;s a great idea and can see large, stable, operations getting involved in this.  Your University&#039;s idea is quite the hybrid approach (co-op and leasehold, yet still somewhat private) and will be a success as long as it remains pure in its mission (unlike the UBC leasehold endowment trust lands which have become luxury pads beyond the pay scale of most professors).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s quite common in Japan for employees to take housing from their employers.  This home is not owned but is rented from the employer at a seriously subsidized amount (average about 33% of market value).  Where I was renting privately a small studio for about $800/month one of my Japanese friends not too far away (two stations) had a two bedroom place for $400/month.  There are also often dormitories for employees to rent (like college dorms) with shared facilities which are ridiculously cheap (think about $100 or even free).  While handy they sure do not lend well to a social life separate from the firm.  And this is not a new idea.  It&#8217;s been done since forever.</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s a great idea and can see large, stable, operations getting involved in this.  Your University&#8217;s idea is quite the hybrid approach (co-op and leasehold, yet still somewhat private) and will be a success as long as it remains pure in its mission (unlike the UBC leasehold endowment trust lands which have become luxury pads beyond the pay scale of most professors).</p>
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		<title>By: ARDELL</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326774</link>
		<dc:creator>ARDELL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 18:01:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326774</guid>
		<description>Cautious Buyer asks? &quot;So what is the agent’s role in this community?&quot;

Sorry to confuse you, there&#039;s nothing in it for me.

I was not involved in the purchase and sale of these homes.  At present I am trying to assist some Powers That Be in acquiring land for &quot;an idea&quot;.  My premise is &quot;their idea&quot; is incorrect, and so I am exploring &quot;ideas&quot;.  You can&#039;t go get something if you don&#039;t first know what you are going to do with that something.  So I can&#039;t...or won&#039;t help them &quot;go get it&quot; if I can&#039;t buy into the &quot;they shoud have it&quot; and I suspect that is partly the reason why they haven&#039;t been able to &quot;get&quot; enough of &quot;it&quot; to date.

Back to the University and my role. The &quot;homeowners&quot; started thinking this way.  OK, I&#039;m going to get 5% to 8% appreciation no matter what while the homes in the area are appreciating at a higher rate.  If I&#039;m going to get the same appreciation whether I run the place into the ground or maintain it well, I may as well run it into the ground.

Also the HOA dues were supposed to maintain the pool and common areas, but the owners spent the money on parties and other things, thinking the University will have to shell out the money to fix the pool eventually out of safety concerns.  They started viewing everythng as &quot;a company benefit&quot; and using in a way that forced the employer to pour in more &quot;benefit&quot;.

It&#039;s a shame really...could have been a great concept if the owners were a bit more responsible and utopian in their efforts.  It&#039;s still there and I&#039;m sure it&#039;s just fine without me, but the concept that people would intentionally ruin real estate was just not my cup of tea.

As to &quot;The University&quot; there were a few pitfalls as in people who have limited and guaranteed capture of appreciation, sometimes fall short and &quot;utopian principles&quot; did not prevail.  A good thing can turn bad because human nature is sometimes not a good thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cautious Buyer asks? &#8220;So what is the agent’s role in this community?&#8221;</p>
<p>Sorry to confuse you, there&#8217;s nothing in it for me.</p>
<p>I was not involved in the purchase and sale of these homes.  At present I am trying to assist some Powers That Be in acquiring land for &#8220;an idea&#8221;.  My premise is &#8220;their idea&#8221; is incorrect, and so I am exploring &#8220;ideas&#8221;.  You can&#8217;t go get something if you don&#8217;t first know what you are going to do with that something.  So I can&#8217;t&#8230;or won&#8217;t help them &#8220;go get it&#8221; if I can&#8217;t buy into the &#8220;they shoud have it&#8221; and I suspect that is partly the reason why they haven&#8217;t been able to &#8220;get&#8221; enough of &#8220;it&#8221; to date.</p>
<p>Back to the University and my role. The &#8220;homeowners&#8221; started thinking this way.  OK, I&#8217;m going to get 5% to 8% appreciation no matter what while the homes in the area are appreciating at a higher rate.  If I&#8217;m going to get the same appreciation whether I run the place into the ground or maintain it well, I may as well run it into the ground.</p>
<p>Also the HOA dues were supposed to maintain the pool and common areas, but the owners spent the money on parties and other things, thinking the University will have to shell out the money to fix the pool eventually out of safety concerns.  They started viewing everythng as &#8220;a company benefit&#8221; and using in a way that forced the employer to pour in more &#8220;benefit&#8221;.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a shame really&#8230;could have been a great concept if the owners were a bit more responsible and utopian in their efforts.  It&#8217;s still there and I&#8217;m sure it&#8217;s just fine without me, but the concept that people would intentionally ruin real estate was just not my cup of tea.</p>
<p>As to &#8220;The University&#8221; there were a few pitfalls as in people who have limited and guaranteed capture of appreciation, sometimes fall short and &#8220;utopian principles&#8221; did not prevail.  A good thing can turn bad because human nature is sometimes not a good thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Sandy K</title>
		<link>http://raincityguide.com/2008/10/17/employers-can-provide-affordable-housing/#comment-326773</link>
		<dc:creator>Sandy K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 17:48:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://raincityguide.com/?p=2771#comment-326773</guid>
		<description>I do agree that if the professors could only sell to other professors, and if prices are determined by the university&#039;s policy, then an agent might not have much of a role in a sale, other than contract administration.  Doesn&#039;t mean it&#039;s not still a good idea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do agree that if the professors could only sell to other professors, and if prices are determined by the university&#8217;s policy, then an agent might not have much of a role in a sale, other than contract administration.  Doesn&#8217;t mean it&#8217;s not still a good idea.</p>
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