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Name: Gordon
Nickname: Gordon
Member since: 2007-11-20 18:22:53
Website URL: http://blog.seattlehouses.com
About me: I am the managing broker for Real Property Associates, Inc., an independent full service real estate company located in North Seattle. Since 1991 we’ve done over $1b in residential and commercial transactions — all of this in the greater Puget Sound area, with a concentration in the neighborhoods located near downtown and North Seattle. In this time our team has grown to become one of the largest independent real estate companies in the region, with annual sales approaching $200m and over 60 licensed professionals. We have a full array of services available to our clients — residential and commercial brokerage; property management; residential lending; and a sister company, Real Property Development Co., LLC (www.rpdevco.com) which does residential and multfamily development and construction. In addition, I still work with a small group of buyers and sellers each year, and as a “selling” broker, I feel like I have some insight into the challenges that face our agents and the principals we represent in this ever-changing marketplace. I am also an advisor and on the board of directors for Zillow.com, an online real estate community, a trustee for Seattle's Union Gospel Mission, and on Lake Forest Park's Economic Development Commission.
Name: Gordon
Nickname: Gordon
Member since: 2007-11-20 18:22:53
Website URL: http://blog.seattlehouses.com
About me: I am the managing broker for Real Property Associates, Inc., an independent full service real estate company located in North Seattle. Since 1991 we’ve done over $1b in residential and commercial transactions — all of this in the greater Puget Sound area, with a concentration in the neighborhoods located near downtown and North Seattle. In this time our team has grown to become one of the largest independent real estate companies in the region, with annual sales approaching $200m and over 60 licensed professionals. We have a full array of services available to our clients — residential and commercial brokerage; property management; residential lending; and a sister company, Real Property Development Co., LLC (www.rpdevco.com) which does residential and multfamily development and construction. In addition, I still work with a small group of buyers and sellers each year, and as a “selling” broker, I feel like I have some insight into the challenges that face our agents and the principals we represent in this ever-changing marketplace. I am also an advisor and on the board of directors for Zillow.com, an online real estate community, a trustee for Seattle's Union Gospel Mission, and on Lake Forest Park's Economic Development Commission.
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- Jerry Gropp Architect AIA: That's not so good.
- Jerry Gropp Architect AIA: As to "you must be s
- Rhonda Porter: Some of the fine tun
- Rhonda Porter: you must be so excit
- Jerry Gropp Architect AIA: Hi Rhonda- Good to s




Listing Square Footage -- How hard can it be?
May 28th, 2008 at 3:44 pmFunny! Well, the commissions come out of the seller’s proceeds, so the seller must pay them, right?
Just kidding, Ardell, please ignore
I think if agents can just make a real attempt to be accurate and transparent, it will go a long way towards improving the situation. If that means “per county records” or “per appraisal” then that’s fine. Most owners have an appraisal that was done sometime by an “objective expert” who was qualified to do the measuring.
Sunday Night Stats on Monday Morning
May 8th, 2008 at 9:31 amSome of our developments actually have “detached” townhomes, which are effectively single family homes on small lots. Most are comprised of small clusters, duplex and triplex buildings. And the way these are built, your adjacent neighbor could really let his place go and other than the roof (which replacement is called for in the CCR’s) it won’t physically damage your unit.
As for covenants, there are some on the shortplat calling for — as Kary noted — roof/painting. We overlay that with an eight page document that our attorney writes for each project which hopefully covers more of the eventualities. Sort of like the CCR’s for a planned development like Mill Creek with some design covenants and “no blue tarp” rules.
I own a condo and I really dislike being part of an association — too many cooks in the kitchen. I want to spend money to maintain and upgrade, and most owners want to just do the bare minimum. Like those neighborhoods of neglected ramblers. I’d rather take care of my own spaces like we can do with the zero lotlines.
Free Flushes?
May 4th, 2008 at 4:41 pmI think the tank is opaque so you can see the water level and feel good about having the grey-reserve with which to flush. We could also close it into a closet so it’s not visible in the garage but what would be the fun of that? I’ve emailed the manufacturer and asked him to respond to some of these questions as I have no idea how the tank it will “look” after years of use. But I suspect that it will work just fine in practice.
Free Flushes?
May 3rd, 2008 at 9:52 amYes, the bronze looking valve in the upper left is a shutoff, which diverts flow from the system and into the main line. Ardell can turn it every six weeks if she doesn’t want to dye her toilets black.
As for cost, I’m estimating. The unit itself is about $2,000 (varies depending on size), and there was maybe an additional $2500 in plumbing upticks and project management costs. If we did 10 in a row in a given project I’m sure the unit and install would be closer to $3,000 — once we got the hang of it.
I don’t think this is something that could be easily jury-rigged. The city really wanted to see something designed for this purpose, and the manufacturer helped a bit in seeing it through the permitting process. There are backflow valves (to keep the greywater out of the domestic supply) and other bells and whistles too.
Free Flushes?
May 2nd, 2008 at 9:00 pmArdell — your technical questions are good ones. If you don’t shower at home, there is a domestic supply line into the tank that always provides fresh and clear flushing water. If you shower too much, once the tank is full, the overflow runs into the sewer line. As for dying your hair…don’t know. Haven’t had that reality yet. But aren’t you supposed to do that in the barber’s sink?
$450/year water-sewer bill? Maybe it’s just more expensive in the city but that was my bill in a hot September last year after watering for two months!
Free Flushes?
May 2nd, 2008 at 1:38 pmVeggie — would be hard to make it work in a retrofit as you have to plumb both drain lines (from shower) and supply lines (to toilet) to do it. But I’m sure where there’s a will, there’s a way. Our vendor is: http://www.bracsystems.com/home.html
Yang — There is a filter which needs to be maintained, depending on use, about quarterly. Other than that, there should be no maintenance. One other issue is that if you lose power, the pump won’t work, in which case you’ll have to manually switch your flush supply over to the clean domestic water source.
Michael — this from the vendor’s website (not from me): “…can help you save 35% to 40% on your annual water bill, and while saving money, you will also help save the environment and provide a better future for our children and their children to come.”
I Dig Dueling Digs
April 3rd, 2008 at 7:46 pmReba — the terms and conditions, which one agrees to when they upload, give Zillow the right to use the photos for this and other purposes. I know when I hire a photographer to shoot my listing, I get authority to do whatever I want with those photos, including put them online and “out there” for the world to see. That’s the point of it.
As for privacy..well, what can you do? You’ve uploaded that picture of your master bedroom closet, warts and all. It’s out there. I think the horse is out of the barn.
And libel? Unless the photos are somehow altered. I don’t think it’s libelous if your ugly green carpet doesn’t win all of its head to head encounters. The photo don’t get altered in this process.
I Dig Dueling Digs
April 2nd, 2008 at 8:43 amZillow gets all of its revenue from advertising…when you’re playing DD, you’re also being exposed to targeted advertising (e.g. when I was looking at those backyards, John Deere was showing me its lawnmower and tractor selection). More page views = more ad inventory to sell.
And anything that makes users engage and use the site helps to drive traffic. Click away!
3 Steps to Understanding Real Estate Commissions
March 19th, 2008 at 3:55 pmArdell,
I agree with the disclosure of the fee to the buyer. I would want to see it in the contract that the buyer signs.
3 Steps to Understanding Real Estate Commissions
March 19th, 2008 at 3:42 pmPatent Guy,
I like your formula, or at least the concept — make the agent vested in those last, hard-to-get incremental price gains. I think that’s one alternative to the current system.
As for me, I’d sign the hypothetical deal as presented. It’s a little grating to see any agent get that kind of a pay day for such little time invested. But I’m netting out well more than I would selling it conventionally and paying some commission to other agents at my $500k value. Better than even selling it FSBO, as this agent will do all the work getting the buyer closed without my babysitting him and I still net my number.
I’ve always found negotiating with the other principal, rather than his agent, nets a more productive result. If the talks stall, and the agent chooses to kick in to preserve the deal and what’s left of his fee, so be it; but he’s usually a lot happier if it’s his idea.
3 Steps to Understanding Real Estate Commissions
March 19th, 2008 at 2:23 pmThis is all interesting stuff. I have a hypothetical for you, Ardell.
What if, oddly, you were a seller, and you knew your house was worth $500k. Assume you were well educated on the market and you felt great about getting that price. And an agent comes with a cash offer, unsolicited, from his buyer for $550,000, asking for a 10% commission. Do you sign it, netting out around the full value you think the house is worth? Or do you counter at $535,000 with the logic that you only want to pay a “traditional” 3% fee, and not give the broker this $55,000 windfall?
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 18th, 2008 at 3:34 pmWell you’re a regular D.B. Cooper, aren’t you?
It’s an important topic and it probably deserves its own post. I’ll look forward to reading more of what you have to say on the issue.
re/your response to Doug’s comment, and for my clarification, where in the Sherman Act or license law does it say we can’t even discuss commissions in a forum like this? I know we can’t collude to fix pricing (e.g. “our fee is set at X”), but it seems like a general or even specific dialogue on the topic doesn’t create any antitrust issues.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 18th, 2008 at 2:42 amArdell,
I love the spirit of what you’re saying here – who can argue with being “fair?” And I think most experienced agents practice what you’re preaching to some extent rather than sticking to a hard line of the traditional fee structure. Lots of examples of negotiating a unique fee come to mind as I think back on it, on both sides of the deal.
I say let information reign, let the invisible hand do its thing, and this issue takes care of itself. A “fair” fee to the super agent (and btw, when I say “super” agent, I don’t mean necessarily mean the gal with the most listings or the biggest ads — the best agent OF COURSE isn’t always the most productive. Usually not. They’re just the most productive) should be higher than the fee for the B-Team junior guy, just like I pay a higher hourly rate to the partner at Davis Wright than I do to the solo practicioner in Lake City. In some things you do get what you pay for.
This negotiation is already happening in the marketplace more and more — as the information assymetry decreases (thanks to lots of things, the internet, Zip, Redfin, YOU). But that free market still says that as agents we’re entitled to get paid as much (or as little) as we can fairly negotiate. For my work week, for Doug’s, for yours, that rate should be higher than average, as we’re (hopefully) better-than-average agents. And I mean higher on per deal and an absolute basis.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 17th, 2008 at 1:54 pmArdell,
There are lots of options and like every RE deal, probably not one size fits all. Your logic is reasonable, of course — everyone makes a “fair” wage in the process.
Defining fair is what is difficult…so often the “easy” commission subsidizes all of those deals where there the fee is “hard” to earn, or not earned at all ($0 per hour is sometimes our rate, as we all know). That’s not fair to the “easy” client and so on.
Anyway, we’ve heard much of this before. I think as buyers and sellers get more educated, and agents get similarly enlightened, maybe we get closer to a better bargain for all parties.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 17th, 2008 at 10:48 am“6. Tax break for fees paid ( do we already have something like this?)”
I think Q means for the consumer. The fees (commissions) you pay as a seller are deducted from any capital gains taxes as a cost of sale, like escrow, title, etc. If you pay a buyer’s agent, those commissions get capitalized into your purchase and increase your tax basis. So yes, there’s already some tax break for those fees.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 17th, 2008 at 10:29 amWhat do you have your agents at Brio do? Do you dictate some guidelines or let them decide for themselves what works best?
Can the flat fee equal > 6% on a lower end deal, or a complicated transaction (e.g. $130,000 Kent condo, or a raw land sale)?
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 17th, 2008 at 7:34 amI used trial lawyers as it was specific that way in the “least admired” list which I referenced. You have to admit, lawyer jokes aside, that at least SOME are excellent and productive. Of course, check out their ratings before buying: http://www.avvo.com.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 16th, 2008 at 6:34 pmGreg, I like this type of market too, it doesn’t favor either side quite so much — at least in Seattle. Outlying areas seem to be more of a buyer’s market. Really, the only fun thing about the superheated market of ‘99-2005 was that all of the people we sold houses to between ‘89 and ‘99 become equity rich (or cash rich if they refinanced their equity out. Or toy rich if they spent those refinance proceeds on consumer stuff.).
Affluent Renter, why are you bitter? Your posts don’t seem vitriolic.
As for finding the best agents available, it’s been interesting to see some local builders fire their “dirt brokers” to whom they have traditionally been beholden for listbacks (listings on the finished spec homes), in favor of more traditional marketing type agents whom they perceive to be better equipped to move their product. I haven’t seen that “breach” of loyalty really ever, but it’s totally understandable. And in some cases, the builder’s bankers are “encouraging” the change if the listings aren’t moving.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 15th, 2008 at 9:47 pmQ-diddy:
1. Why shouldn’t all agents earn a 4 year degree in RE in college? Why can’t there be degrees offered specifically for agents?
>I’m sure there is a four year RE degree offered somewhere. Maybe WSU’s Center for RE? More helpful I think are the advanced creditials that you can get once you’re licensed.
2. What does having advanced degrees in other professions have anything to do with making u a good agent?
>Great question. Maybe if it’s an MBA or JD some people would perceive the agent to have some higher knowledge or credibility. I’ve seen one agent with “MD” on their sign. I can’t imagine that helps much with making them a good agent, unless it’s to prescribe antidepressants when the listing doesn’t sell
3. Should there be a minimum amount of experience hours before one can practice?
>I think this would be great. Lots of industries which maybe have less potential impact on the consumer require years of apprenticeship. Many RE companies require new agents to act as runners, or assistants, to more experienced agents, before letting them loose.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 15th, 2008 at 9:40 pmb – you make a good point about an “hourly charge system” and I think the industry is starting to create more types of fee-for-service options. I know our company has done hourly fee consulting for years as an alternative to the pure commission model. But the public still seems to prefer having an agent with “skin in the game.” We don’t get paid until we perform, and then we get paid well.
Or maybe the great agents should do a lower end, first time homeowner deal every now and then — like a top attorney might do a pro bono case. I think it would help ensure that the entry tier of buyers have a good experience with their process.
Or maybe the market can just self-select the bad agents out of business. Agent ratings and things like that which we’re seeing more of online will help this along.
Used Car Salesmen, Trial Lawyers and Real Estate Agents
March 15th, 2008 at 9:34 pmJillayne, Ardell & Courtney — Thanks for the greetings! And thanks to Dustin for encouraging me to post & for the flattering intro.
Jillayne: As far as “getting what you pay for” in an agent, to large degree the market takes care of this for you. If you’re doing a high end deal, that 3% is going to buy the best, most experienced agents out there. There will be lots of interest in helping you out. If you’re a first time buyer looking at $200,000 condos in Everett, not so much — the uber agents typically won’t take the time to do a deal that not only pays a lot less, but can actually take much more time to do well (educate a buyer, work through minimum down financing, show lots of inventory, etc.).
I knew one of these great agents who used to market on this basis: “If you’re paying 3% anyway, why not get the most experienced, the best agent that you can get? I’m that guy!” I thought he had a good point.