The High Cost of Buying a Home & Selling a Home

Even if you are a First Time Homebuyer, you should be keenly aware of the cost of selling a home. Often people think they can just sell their home if they pick the wrong one, or if they get a new job out of town. But the cost of selling is usually many Xs the cost of buying.

It is good to be mindful of the cost of leaving…the home you are buying…before you buy one.

The Closing Costs/Expenses associated with Selling a home are fairly simple, but in $ much more costly than a Buyer’s Closing Costs. Also a buyer can pay ALL of their costs without “hard dollars” in most cases. A Seller is not afforded that “convenience”. Sometimes homebuyers call financing their closing costs “seller paid them”…but in reality the seller is not paying them…you are financing them in whole or in part, unless you are a cash buyer.

The three BIG costs for sellers are”

1) Paying off your existing mortgage(s) and other lienable utilities (Usually water sewer and trash) Not a “Closing Cost”, but likely the largest expense nonetheless. Be sure to add one month’s interest to your principal when estimating your payoffs, which you should do before you list your house to avoid surprises at closing.

2) Paying the Real Estate Agents, both your agent and the buyer’s agent, will be deducted on the seller side of the Closing Statement from the Sale Price and Net Proceeds.

3) State Excise Tax at the rate of 1.78% of the sold price.

RE Commissions & Excise Tax = the big bulk of true “costs” associated with selling a house. These on a combined basis usually range from 6% to 8% of the Sold Price depending on what services you use.

Note: The buyer determines what service and/or representation they will use when purchasing a home, and who will provide them with that representation/service. But the cost of the Buyer’s representation will still be deducted from the Seller’s Net Proceeds IN FULL, even if the cost is less than the Seller anticipated. Generally the rule is the Seller can negotiate the cost for the Seller Services, but any savings on the Buyer side commission goes to the Buyer…even though that commission shows and is deducted on the Seller side.

Other Seller Costs:

Owner’s Title Insurance – price dependent, but not a %. The Agent for the Seller usually orders Preliminary Title before listing the house. So you can get a quote. About $1,000 give or take? Depends on price of home within a few ranges of price. The cost doesn’t go up by each $ of price. Here’s a Title Cost Calculator but you have to sign in. Maybe a Title Rep will pop in the comments and give more info on that. I’m seeing a range from $850 to $1200, even though the price difference on the two houses is HUGE! So plan on $1,000 or so, and get a quote as soon as you pick a listing agent/service.

Seller’s “half” of the Escrow Fees – usually quoted as half…so don’t take the quote and half it again. About the same as Title Insurance, give or take, with the same method of calculation. DO NOT take the election for the $50 discount if YOU use the same place for Title and Escrow! You pick Title and let the BUYER choose escrow. (my soapbox…buyer should choose escrow!)

A couple of misc fees like notary or courier and what not. Throw $500 in misc and that should be more than enough.

Summary of Seller costs =
RE commissions for BOTH agents/services. Usually 4% to 6% +
Excise Tax 1.78% +
Title Insurance , Escrow Service and Misc – total $2,500 or so
…and paying off your mortgages and lienable utilities and any other liens needed to be cleared from the property. Usually there aren’t others, but there could be unrelated liens like Income Tax, or Judgments. That is why the Agent for the Seller runs Title before the home is listed, to avoid surprises at closing.

Add to that your prorated Real Estate Taxes for the time you live in the house since the last tax bill was paid. That varies depending on the month you close. Conversely you will get a credit from the buyer if you paid those taxes in advance.

HOME INSPECTION REPAIR COSTS – DO NOT list your house without setting aside an amount for the Home Inspection Negotiation. How much you should set aside differs from one house to the next, and your agent should be able to give you a rough estimate. It depends on the age of your roof, heater, hot water tank, etc. It does NOT depend on whether or not those things function well!

AGE! Age of item is now the issue…not merely it’s condition. I do not recommend that the seller do an inspection before listing the home. But that’s another topic.

In a nutshell…if a seller is selling a home for $400,000 and has NO mortgage to pay off, their total costs will be about $30,000 – $40,000! Lots of costs for the seller.

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HOME BUYER CLOSING COSTS and EXPENSES

If you are paying cash for your house…the only real costs are:

Escrow Closing Fee plus some misc charges like Recording Fee. $1,000 give or take. You still have to or should get Insurance (fire insurance, etc)…but escrow will not be requiring that in order for you to close, and may not handle it for you if you are a cash buyer. You will HAVE Owner’s Title Insurance…but that is paid for by the seller.

The closing costs jump up from $1,000 CONSIDERABLY when you are using financing to purchase…and many if not most people are.

The largest cost for a Homebuyer, potentially, are the Lender Fees. That said, more and more people are electing to NOT have Lender Fees. That creates a “higher” rate…but when that higher rate is 3.875%…it doesn’t seem high. So negating the lender costs is more common during a period of low rates than it is during a period of higher rates. No good reason for that, as the increase to rate as a % is the same…just is what it is.

Lender Fees can be anywhere from almost nothing to 1.50% or so. So shopping for costs AND rate is a big job for the homebuyer.

I’ll let the lenders jump in the comments and explain that better. Often you will see lender costs of $4,500 and then a Lender Credit against those costs of $4,200 reducing the actual cost to $300. That is a means to the almost no lender cost solution. You still have to sign disclosures for the actual costs, even though the net impact will be much lower. Again…I’ll leave that to lenders to explain, I can only tell you that is what I see, but not the why of it.

You need Lender’s Title Insurance. The Seller paid for Owner’s Title, which is all you need if you pay cash for a house. But if you have financing you need to purchase Lender’s Title which is based on the Loan Amount vs the Purchase Price. About $1,000 give or take.

Home Inspection and Appraisal Fees ($450 or so) and other misc loan associated costs I include in “lender fees” above. Though if you don’t buy the house…you still have to pay the Appraiser. So Home Inspection Fee and Appraisal Fee of $1000 or so usually have to be paid even if you don’t end up closing, after those are completed.

NOTE: You may need MORE than “a home inspector” depending on the house. Sewer Scope by a different contractor…Structural Engineer Evaluation depending on the house…drain inspection if there are cement drain systems, which many have. I’m not going to run the gamut of extra inspections that may be needed, as this is a house to house issue. But DO KNOW that most Home Inspections do not do all of the inspections you may need for a particular home. It depends on the home.

Half the Escrow Fee…same as Seller…again what you are quoted IS half…so don’t half it again.

One Year Paid up Fire Insurance Policy = paid at closing. I am calling it Fire Insurance so you don’t get it confused with Owner’s Title Insurance. It covers more than fire, but in my experience if I don’t call it Fire Insurance, people do not totally “get” what I mean when I say Hazard Insurance or Homeowner’s Insurance. Fire Insurance everyone understands…even though that insurance covers more than damage from a fire.

Note: Cost of Homeowner’s/Hazard/Fire Insurance is whacky right now. Be sure to get a few quotes and make sure they are running your history of previous claims. People with previous claims on the homes they have owned in the past are paying through the nose lately. So don’t only go by the house itself…get a REAL quote and early. Usually right after the Home Inspection.

Recording Fees about $150 to $200 depending on how many loan instruments you are recording. Just throw in $500 for misc, same as the seller.

TOTAL ACTUAL COSTS FOR A HOME BUYER

Lender Fees+ Home Inspection and Appraisal Fees + Fire Insurance (one year paid in advance) + Lender’s Title Insurance + Escrow Closing Fee + Recording Fees + $500 misc. I can’t even give you a total number, as these vary greatly due to the Lender Fee issue. But let’s say it’s usually around $7,500 or so, depending on the Price of the Home. I’m only putting a number so you know it’s not a few bucks, and something you need to prepare for with your Agent before you make an offer.

Notice I said prepare for with your AGENT and not your LENDER! I know it is customary around these parts for The Lender to “do that”. But why? Really? The biggest buyer side closing cost on the HUD 1 to evaluate is the Lender’s Fees. Your agent needs to help you with that…not your lender, because you need to do that BEFORE choosing a lender, and as part of the basis for choosing a lender.

A note about Real Estate Commissions…it’s a tough issue on the buyer side because it was already negotiated with the seller and often not discussed with the buyer. MAKE your agent talk to you about what they will being paid to represent you. You must have that talk…and often you need to initiate that discussion.

CLUE: “The seller pays it” is NOT the answer to How much is your agent charging for the service to YOU. “I don’t know yet” could be the answer to the question, as what the seller is offering to pay your agent varies from one house to the next. You and YOUR agent should determine the cost…and then later compare that to what the seller is offering, so you can “settle up” if there is a difference.

FREE is NOT the answer…in fact if the agent says FREE…go find another agent and fast.

That is usually done via an Agent Credit toward closing costs and absolutely needs to be addressed at time of Offer, to avoid your losing any “excess” credits to the Agent or to the Seller of the home.

No one wants to hear that the answer to Total Buyer’s Closing Costs is “it varies greatly” depending on which agent…which lender, etc. So here are some real numbers.

On a $250,000 VA purchase, $11,500 dollars reduced to zero paid…Up Front VA funding fee financed and the balance of about $6,000 paid with seller and Agent Credits. The Seller credit is the buyer financing it. The Agent Credit = a “true” reduction of cost…kind of. 🙂

On a $400,000 house purchase with Conventional Loan $9,000 with low Lender Fees.

OK…time to talk about why that one is $9,000…as a $400,000 home with low lender fees should not COST $9,000.

PREPAIDS! Prepaids vary a LOT depending on when you close. This time of year the amount you have to pay to your lender in Real Estate Tax Impounds is HUGE because the taxes are due in April and if you close in Jan your first mortgage payment is not until March. So they have to pay 6 months of Taxes in April and will only have one payment from you to do that with. So they will collect 5 or 6 months of RE taxes from you at closing…even though they are not due until April. They may pay them in March for an early payment discount. Not sure. But the impounds for RE Taxes can be a Big Chunk of Change, for sure.

You pay your one year policy for Fire Insurance up front. You are “Pre-paying” that. The cost of that is going up, from what I can see. YOUR insurance can vary greatly from your friend’s and neighbors based on previous claims, how much jewelry or expensive artwork or very expensive furniture you have in your home. Even the value of your cars, as some mishaps that damage your car are covered, like a tree falling on it or your roof shingles blowing down on your car and scratching the paint.

OK…enough talk about costs. The Seller’s costs are many times more than the Buyer’s costs, and there are many ways to reduce the costs from the “max”.

My best advice…Do not DECIDE to buy or sell a home…until you get a real estimate of your costs to do so, in advance. You may just decide the cost isn’t worth it. 🙂

Ardell’s Seattle Area Real Estate Blog – Most Visited Posts

It amazes me sometimes, which of my posts garner the highest readership. Dustin tracks the “per post” stats for Rain City Guide and shows us which garner the most eyeballs…from time to time.

I was looking at the numbers over on my blog, which likely gets a fraction of the activity as my writings here. But once in awhile I get surprised by a single post getting over 20,000 views…for just one post. Usually they are posts that spark an interest nationally vs primarily local here in “The Seattle Area”.

Here are the blog posts with the most views, not necessarily in the order of highest to lowest:

Sex and Real Estate – AKA What’s Cooking in the Master Bedroom?

How is a Real Estate Transaction like a Pregnant Woman?

Negotiating Real Estate Commissions

Should I Buy a House Now? (Amazing how this post from Summer of 2008 is still equally as relevant today.

For Buyers Who are Relocating to Seattle – The Yes, No, Maybe tour method

Split Entry Homes and the different names they are called around the Country.

Ardell’s Anatomy of a Real Estate Transaction which is the older and longer version of This Year’s “From Contract to Close of Escrow”, written here on Rain City Guide.

What Does a Real Estate Agent Do?

Is your townhome a condo or a single family home?

Do I need to Sell My House before I Buy a New One?

Home Sales Way Down October 2007

Who do you make your Earnest Money check payable to?

The Appraisal in the Home Purchase and Sale Process

Sample Closing Statement – HUD 1 I posted the link to the source I now use vs my original post, given there have been changes over time. I used this the other day for a client who is closing in January. You can plug in the estimated numbers and save it and email it. It’s a very good idea for buyers and sellers to see these numbers on the form they will be signing at closing, as early in the process as possible.

Kirkland Real Estate Stats as of Today (that “today” was a long time ago. I’m doing the 2011 stats now. Will be interesting to do them on the same basis for comparison purposes, with the same type of charts.

Pottery Barn Paint Colors and other tips on your Seattle Home

Homes “Sold” by Ardell DellaLoggia – a running and updated catalogue of homes where I represented the Buyer or the Seller, noting which I represented for each home.

Toll Brothers Comes to Seattle

CamWest announced, via email to its clients and prospective clients, that they have been purchased by Toll Brothers.camwest The CamWest logo now says “A Toll Brothers Company”. I’ve long been a huge fan of Toll Brothers since my early days in Real Estate back in Bucks County, PA.

Toll Brothers made the announcement back on November 21st, and I found the comments made by Toll Brothers CEO to be interesting, spot on and less “fluffy”.

CEO Douglas Yearley Jr. said the CamWest acquisition does not represent the start of a broader expansion push by Toll, which operates in 20 states.

“We have been looking at Seattle for a decade, so this was a bit of a long time coming, and we found the right opportunity,

2012 Conforming and FHA Loan Limits for King County

The 2012 Conforming and FHA loan limits for King, Pierce and Snohomish Counties have been announced… ready for a little twist?  Conforming loan limits will remain the same as they currently are and FHA loan limits will be restored to the higher “temporary” loan limits that were available prior to October 1, 2011.

For a single unit residential property in King, Snohomish and Pierce County, the 2012 loan limits are:

  • $506,000 Conforming
  • $567,500 FHA – NOTE: FHA loan limits are effective as of November 18, 2011.

Yep… for the first time (I’m guessing ever) FHA loan limits are higher than conforming!  I’m reading in the blogo-sphere that the higher FHA loan limits are available – HOWEVER, I am not seeing this from HUD (on their loan limit site or a Mortgagee Letter) or from any of the lenders I work with.  Until I see something from HUD or a wholesale lender saying they’re accepting the higher FHA loan limits, then my assumption is that $506,000 is the loan limit through the end of this year.  If I learn otherwise, I’ll let you know!

UPDATE December 5, 2011:  HUD published a mortgage letter Friday and updated their website this morning (or in the wee hours last night) with the higher loan limits.

Starter Home Styles in Seattle – Part 1

If you are planning to buy a home in Seattle for about $350,000, it may be of some help for you to know how to generally evaluate the floor plan, before entering the home. This should make choosing homes to see from the internet photos, and other information available on the internet, a little easier and more productive.

We’ll start with the basic 1-Story w/basement, often referred to as a “bungalow”.

1-story with basement


When you see a house for sale like this one in an Internet Listing, you first note the “Style” as “One Story with Basement”. This is a required data field, so it should not be missing from the listing detail. This cross gabled style was most common from around 1917 to 1922 or so. There are several other styles of one story with basement homes, but the below information should be fairly common to all.

I happen to be looking at one of these right now in Seattle. The mls Listing says 1,550 sf. 1,550 sf sounds like a decent sized house…until you go to the house and say “too small”. In fact, let’s look at the actual comments from a client who viewed it at an open house.

(Note: In accordance with mls rules, the picture of the home is a “reasonable facsimile” from somewhere else in the Country. The rest of the detail is the actual info of a home viewed by my clients in Seattle. Mls rules prohibit identifying the actual home that is currently for sale, in a blog post.)

Actual Client Comments:

Hi Ardell,
We went to the Open House and here is what we liked:

– Beautiful kitchen, good size
– Nice modern upgrades
– nice backyard and outside area
– Neighborhood feel and street was nice and quiet

Things we didn’t like:

– two small bedrooms on main floor, master in basement.

-The setup doesn’t seem conducive to a young family. The rooms were VERY small on the main floor. Living room was small, but if we had to deal with this we could…just not ideal. No dining area or even any room for a table

– House runs on oil. Not sure we like the idea of that

Now that the client has identified some likes and dislikes…we look at the dislikes and check that info against the home’s “main floor footprint”. Not all “1,550” sf homes are alike. You need to break that down to save yourself a lot of time and trouble in your home search process.

An oddity in the Seattle Area as to how we identify square footage in the mls, requires that your FIRST step be to go to the King County Parcel Viewer to identify the square footage of the house (main floor footprint) vs the basement level.

What this client is actually saying, and not surprisingly, is that “a bungalow” may be too small for a family planning to have children.

The Breakdown of the house from the King County Parcel Viewer tells us that while the mls allows the description of “1,550 sf” for “the house”, this is really a 775 sf house with a basement.

That is how using this process for subsequent home selections can save you a ton of time and disappointment.

Let’s look at the home details and learn from both the data and the feedback from the client.

The County Record for this house, plus the mls system data, tells us:

Bungalow Description

You can use the above format as a general template. If you are lucky, you will find a little hand drawn sketch of the original main floor footprint from the County Records site, as I did here.

A few notes:

– Lot size of 4,450 sf is acceptable…but smaller than current zoning requirements
Oil heat…but forced air vs baseboard system. Forced air can be converted to gas and even have air conditioning, as long as gas is “available” in the street. A quick search of the area for neighbors with gas heat and or cooking tells me it is available, and in fact the majority of homes in the area use gas vs oil at present. Note- where is this oil TANK?
– Main floor foorprints of 800 sf are likely too small (I generally like to see at least 1,000 sf)
– Three bedrooms on one level likely preferred, but master on main and two up may work. (Note: There was no such thing as “a master bedroom” at the time this home was built. Master Bedrooms came out sometime after I was born 🙂 which would be 1954. Not common until the 70s or early 80s. “Where is the master bedroom?” may be an odd question if you are looking at a small home built in 1915.
– “dishwasher” included is often a strong indication of a kitchen upgrade, since dishwashers did not exist in 1915. However that upgrade may have been anytime since the 70s when dishwashers became more commonplace.
– an EXTRA 500 sf detached garage is a considerable feature, especially with alley access, as long as it doesn’t take up the whole yard.

Looking at the sketch, the home “as built” was likely 22 feet across and 33 to 35 feet “deep”. Assuming you need 3′ to “pass” into the rest of the home, that leaves only (22-3) 19 feet for the width of both the bedroom and living room on a combined basis. Hence the “bedroom is small” and “living room is small”.

Once you have the basics covered by seeing a few homes, you can save yourself, and the homeowner, a lot of time and trouble by checking some of these things in advance. Master in the basement is noted in this case in the mls detail. The main floor being less than 800 sf is noted in the County Record.

By checking both the mls data AND the County Record data, you can better set your expectations before going to view a home.

If the seller left their home with the baby and drove around the block for a half hour and the feedback is “I don’t like the master bedroom being in the basement”, the seller will often get a little ticked off (or a LOT) given that information was available prior to viewing the home.

Coming up with some general parameters based on viewing homes at Open Houses or viewing vacant homes for sale, can save you and the seller a lot of time, trouble and frustration.
“A House is a Box you LIVE in”.

There are really not a lot of variations as to how that “box” can be constructed, as noted in that linked post. You really shouldn’t have to visit 100 homes to find the one that is best for you.

Making some general observations, and charting them out as you go
(or having your agent do that for you)
may help to keep you from “settling” for a house that you really don’t want,

just because you are tired of “the process”.

I will cover the other “basic” home styles in subsequent posts, and link them below. This multi-part series should help make your home search process a lot more productive, and enjoyable.

Warning: School Rankings Just Went Whacko!

schoolMany parents or “to be” parents use School Rankings as part of their Home Search Process, and I generally support that wholeheartedly. BUT something is amiss!

I don’t know what just happened. Possibly a new set of test scores just came out? The lineup of schools on most School Rating sites just shifted, and the results are staggeringly “off”. One is always forewarned about using these sites as indicators of a school’s net worth, or an indication that your child will get a better education. But usually they follow the sequence from high to low that blends with the overall frame work of areas and home prices and long term supports for what I call “the lineup” of “Best Schools”.

But for some reason, one of the long term lowest ranked schools just jumped up to highest. Usually the top 1 to 5 schools stay in “a pack” and move around. One year one is “the top school” and then it moves to 2nd place. 3rd can jump to first…and so on.

The 10th ranked school RARELY jumps from tenth to first overnight! I’ve never seen that happen before, and I am seeing it happen today. It could have happened in the last week or so. I don’t check them every day.

Be forewarned…something is amiss. I can’t put my finger on exactly what caused this recent change, and it is fairly overall across different schools and different ranking sites. Just be forewarned that if these sites were ever reliable and/or you have considered them to be so, and I generally have over the years, there is something rotten in Denmark at the moment.

I strongly suggest you not use them in your home search process until we can figure out what the heck just happened.

National Coming Out Day; We’ve come a long way in real estate and lending

October 11th is National Coming Out Day.  As an educator in the real estate and mortgage lending sector, I enjoy hearing stories from students about what it was like to sell real estate and originate loans in the 1950s and 1960s, before the Fair Housing Act of 1968 and the Equal Credit Opportunity Act of 1974.  The young-youngsters in the room are a bit taken aback to hear real-life stories about neighborhood segregation, discrimination against Jews or African Americans, and denying credit to women.  Blockbusting, redlining, and racial discrimination as well as mortgage lending discrimination happened to people who are still around to tell those stories because it really wasn’t that long ago.

Today’s Homebuyers Like Hardwood Floors

Whether it’s a new house or an old house, people like hardwood floors better than carpet, especially on the main floor.

Looking at the stats for North King County, a home without hardwood floors is about 2X as likely not to sell, especially at a price point of $400,000 or more for the home. About 24% to 26% of homes that “expire”, or homes still on market and not sold, do not have hardwood floors. Compare that to only 14% of SOLD homes without hardwood floors and you see that 86% of recent home buyers chose a home that had hardwood floors.

Wide plank, narrow plank, light oak, dark finish…lots of variances as to preference of TYPE of hardwood floor. But hands down, even if the new buyer refinishes the floors to a different color, they choose homes with hardwood floors that they can refinish over homes that would need hardwood floors installed.

While “What type of carpet to use to sell your home?” has not changed much…the better answer for the main living areas is hardwood…hands down.

The “new” preferred color of hardwood is less red than the once popular Brazilian Cherry, darker than the blonde tones of yesteryear, but not quite as dark as the short lived chocolate brown craze that lasted about a millisecond.

A warm chestnut brown is the color of the day.

It’s great for the floors…but a little dull for the kitchen or bathroom cabinetry. The new warm chestnut brown hardwoods are best used when the kitchen and main floor baths are a light colored ceramic tile or a laminate floor that blends the color.

Armstrong calls the color “gunstock”. It’s darker than light…lighter than dark…and solidly BROWN vs orange or red tones. Much easier to decorate a room without clashing with the tone of the hardwoods when using this color in many and varied rooms in the house. As a matching cabinet color choice though…I don’t think that trend will last. It’s just too darned dull to have as a kitchen cabinet color.

If after reading this you have any questions as to the color I am talking about…just visit any new model homes…it’s all the rage…and they are pretty much ALL using it in their model homes.

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(Stats in this post not compiled, verified or published by The Northwest Multiple Listing Service.)

It’s time for a ban on all third party short sale negotiators.

Not a day goes by that I do not hear a story from a Realtor, loan originator or consumer about a questionable if downright bad experience with a third party short sale negotiator. We’ve reached a point in time where we ought to consider eliminating all third party short sale negotiators. At the end of this article I will provide suggestions for home sellers, home buyers, real estate brokers/Realtors, attorneys, and regulators in order to maximize good consequences and minimize bad consequences for all parties.

Yesterday I received a frantic call from a homebuyer we’ll call Maggie, who found me online via this blog post. Maggie fell in love with a short sale house but after her offer was accepted and moving toward the close of escrow, the third party short sale negotiator announced that since the lender would not pay his full fee (short sale negotiator was already being paid $3000), as the buyer, she would have to come up with an additional $7,000 at the close of escrow.  Maggie was in love with the house but didn’t have the extra 7K so the third party short sale negotiator suggested she get a loan and pay him after the close of escrow.

There are so many things wrong with the above scenario I don’t even know where to begin.  So let’s begin at the beginning. The growth of fee-based, third party short sale negotiators was fueled by a perfect storm:

1) Collapse of the real estate bubble and resulting growth of over-mortgaged homeowners.
2) Rapid growth in the need for real estate listing brokers who know how to negotiate a short sale.
3) Decimation of the subprime industry and resulting out-of-work loan originators and Realtors.
4) “Get rich quick